The Zim Family Cocker Spaniel Forum

At six weeks I started taking my foster pups on grass for potty, but I still had their indoor play/sleep area covered completely in newspapers - i didn't discipline for "accidents" at that age. At age 8 weeks they started eating separately, in their own crates (to start getting them used to some independence) and at 10 weeks they were sleeping in their own crates, too. At 10 weeks we also started working on sitting for their food bowl - and they got it : )- DAISY is CUTE!!!

I guess were still looking at about two or three more weeks at least for any type of character developement from Daisy, got it. She already had her breakfast. Dry food, ( Purina One Smart Blend was the best I could find for now), mixed with goat milk, and she LOVED it! She was really going at it! So thumbs up for the recipe.

Another thing you might want to do is give a good puppy vitamin since she is so young. My girls were both 8 weeks old when they came home but I used "Puppy Gold vitamins" on both until they were about 6 months old. You can find it online or at most Petsmarts. As others have said you will have a few more challenges since Daisy is so young, but the love she gives you back will more than make up for the extra work.
I agree with Debbie, other than grooming issues with cocker spaniels I don't think they are any more high maintenance than any other dog, although they do love to be with their people.
If you and your wife are gone with work and school, I would definitely crate train from early on and let Daisy know from the get go that although you leave you will always come back. I would say you have at least three to four weeks before any kind of real training starts, but yes work on housetraining from day one, it won't sink in for her but will be good practice for you

Thank you for the info Becky. I'll definitely search for some vitamins online. Daisy's been doing really good actually; she seems to be coping very well with the situation. My wife is the one having a little more trouble cause Daisy keeps doing her business all over the apt. I'll definitely show her this comment as a confirmation that Daisy will not be ready for real potty training for at least another two weeks. Hey could you specify "crate training". I know you said the objective is to let Daisy know that eventhough I'm gone I will return, but exactly how do you do that:?:

First of all I am glad to hear that Daisy is doing well. There is a very good thread on Housetraining at the top of the training section, Kelly is a really good resource, so read it and go back to it often if needed.

As for crate training,and letting them know you go but you come back. What we did was starting at 8 weeks,(you can start now) we would put Karlie in her crate for rest time,wait until she was quiet and then leave the room, if she cried, or made noise we made sure we did not re-enter the room until she was quiet. We only left for a minute at the begininig working up to longer and longer times the key was to never come back in as long as she was making a fuss, so that she didn't get the idea that making a fuss meant mom or dad would come back. I was home with her the first month we had her then had to go back to work. Since we would be gone for 9 to 10 hours a day and no way to get home in the middle of the day, Karlie was left gated in our master bath with her crate and a puppy grass pad if she had to potty. A couple of weeks before I had to go to work I started putting her in the bathroom (as if going to work) but for shorter periods of time, starting with just a few minutes and extending the time every day, again never entering to let her out if she was crying, howling or barking. It was really hard at first and she about broke my heart howling for me to come back, but I stayed strong thanks to some help from Juanita here on the forum and in a week or two all of that stopped and we've been very lucky no seperation problems with either girl, they still don't like to be left home,they'd much rather go with, but they know we will always come back and that's the important thing. In my opinion Crate Training is the best and easiest way to housetrain, I wasn't as sold on the idea with Karlie and was a lot more lax with it, and Karlie was the easiest dog ever to housetrain, she was completly trained by 4 months old and has had no accidents in the house since that time, Kaitlyn is much better crate trained loves her crate and will go in it just to rest on her own, she was much more of a housetraining challenge, but it is just the differences in personality and make-up I guess.

your situation sounds so much like ours right now. We're gone 9 hours a day and we've been leaving Daisy gated in our bath, just that I haven't been leaving the crate inside the bath. I've only been using the crate for like whenever we're doing something (like cleaning), and we don't want her chasing after us. I do think that's wrong though, cause it's only teaching her that the crate is like a timeout place. So yeah, the crate's definitely going in the bathroom!

When I was housetraining, if we went 30 mins without a trip outside it was long. It was like every 20 mins.

I wouldn't leave a dog, let alone a puppy that age, shut IN the crate for 9 hours. I try not to leave mine longer than 4 or 5 hours, and they have the run of a dog proof room. When Lottie was younger I had her in a big crate, the one I use for golden retrievers when I groom them, so I could have half bedding and toys, half newspaper, and that worked pretty well. It's a good idea for them to be happy to rest in a crate, but not shut in there for so long. If there's no way either of you can get home at lunchtime, you need to find a nice friend or neighbour, or perhaps hire a dog walker, to let her out to potty.

Yeah I agree with everyone. I have been hating the fact that we have to leave Daisy alone for such a long time, specially because I think it's starting to bring out Daisy's bad side. She's been very agressive lately! I come home trying to make up for the time we're gone by playing with her, but all she wants to do is throw a bite at everything and everyone! Eventhough I try distracting her with a toy, it only catches her attention for a second til she ignores it and launches at us with growls and bites! I don't know what to do; I have a great neighbor, but I don't think she's up for the task.

She's not being aggressive at that age, she's just playing. Unfortunately this is going to be one area where she will be at a disadvantage not having her littermates around. Dogs learn bite inhibition from playing with their litter mates. Without them around it's up to you to help her learn not to bite down hard on a human. You can make a little yelpie/ouchie noise when she gets too rough and then redirect her to an appropriate chewie.

If you don't think your neighbor is up to the task can you hire a dog walker? I work a full time job myself so I understand you can't always drop everything and go home in the middle of the day but it's going to be nearly impossible to housebreak her when the time comes if she is left alone for 9hrs.

Did you report the seller to animal control? As was mentioned, it's illegal to sell a puppy that young most places.

Yes, like Holly says, she's just excited and trying to play, she doesn't realise how thin skinned we are compared to her littermates. She'll learn, just squeak loudly and stop the game for a few minutes until she works it out.

I agre with the other posters that she's just playing. Try the shrill yelping and remove your hand. Then hand her a toy. You can also try ending the play at the point that she bites and you yelp. Sometimes it helps when they can start putting together the "I-bite-the-fun-ends" idea (although she is too young to get that right away. Some of these things are the things she'd be working on if she had been left with her momma and siblings longer. Since you got her so young it's stuff you'll have to work on with her instead. It's do-able but it will take time, patience and consistency. The only other piece of information I can offer is try not to use the word "aggressive". If you start using that word people are going to start thinking you have a truly aggressive dog and treating her as such. That will impede her socializing and training for sure.

Hey thanks for the info! I'm actually relieved to know it's not aggression on Daisy's part but rather a playful instinct. I really thought she was being plain mean, I guess just because she bites so HARD!!! The growling and barking, I thought, supported my idea of her being aggressive but, again it's good to know their's a solution to this problem. I didn't do anything about the breeder reason being; I bought Daisy in Mexico. Even if it were illegal I doubt they'd do anything about it over there.

Daisy has no idea what "too hard" means at this stage. Her litter mates would be yelping and stopping play at that point. Check http://www.crickethollowfarm.com/biteinhib.htm for a fairly good explanation of teaching bite inhibition and you can check out Ian Dunbar for other resources. He's regarded as the grandfather of current dog training methods. Patricia McConnell and Karen Pryor are also good people to check out.
I would also be very cautious about labeling anything as "aggressive". It's a label you never want applied to your dog and seldom want even applied to specific behavior. It is also a label not to be applied lightly to any dog. Serious aggression leads to a whole host of problems, not just in the dynamics of the dog and family but with possible consequences like increased licencing fees, muzzling restrictions and potential insurance-coverage issues for your home, etc.
She's so young at this point that she's pretty much a blank slate and with the right shaping and teaching will be a sound little girl.

Everyone has been so kind and helpful and so I am going to stick out like a sore thumb but does anyone else question whether this story is true or if it's made up and the poster is having a bit of "fun"? If it were April 1st I would chalk it up as an April Fool's post.

If I understand correctly, this person basically bought a four-week-old puppy off Facebook from a breeder in Mexico. The puppy has not been dewormed or vacinated. He bought the puppy knowing no one would be home with it for nine hours a day but feels bad for it. The puppy is shut in a laundry room by itself for nine hours every day. The wife is already getting mad that a four-week-old puppy going to the bathroom throughout the apartment. He specifically asked for grocery store dog food suggestion. He knows virtually nothing about having a puppy and is asking after the puppy after it is already there.

I do realize that everyone of these things can be individually explained away but the combination of them all makes me suspicious that it's a poster trying to get everyone's goat.

If it is indeed true than I feel terrible for the puppy, as well as the dog it is very likely to become. The lack of socialization and possible health problems could be heartbreaking. I would think the kindest thing would be to see if he can find someone who has a litter of puppies that this puppy could either live with for at least the next four weeks or at the very least have daily contact. Although I wonder how many people would be okay with having an unvacinated puppy from another country exposed to their puppies? The other less appealing scenerio would be to hire someone to come in every day and spend time with the puppy - even a teenage neighbor after school for a few hours. It would seem merciful to contact a rescue to help find a litter of puppies and have them help find a home with people who can be home with the puppy, and to get another puppy when they aren't both at school and work and have a life style where they can meet the needs of a puppy.

I would say more about Parvo, the dangers of a puppy so isolated and under socialized, the needs of puppies, etc. but I kind of don't think this post isn't a truthful one. For the sake of the puppy, I really hope it is a fictional post.

Either way, I will leave it up to those of you who know far more about raising puppies, if the story is indeed true and if it isn't, I don't want to waste anymore time on it.

I imagine that may be made up - let's face it we really don't know much about each other beyond what we read of each others' postings. However I for one really do not want to take the chance that this poster is in need of information in this situation and may not get it espcially with such a wee one. I sort of choose to err on the side of figuring if someone is making this up, he can have his laugh. If it's true he/she needs the information.

If the OP's profile is accurate he lives on the Tx/Mexico border; it is not uncommon for people to purchase animals in Mexico and bring them back to the US. With the breeder allegedly selling puppies on FB, I'm going to guess they aren't the sort of breeder who follows a vaccination schedule, leaves dogs with their litter mates for several weeks post-weaning or screens buyers to make sure they are fully aware of how to deal with a puppy. People tend to think breeders speak with authority and if an unethical breeder tells a new puppy buyer it's ok to take them home at 4 weeks, most will believe it. This situation is certainly full of 'what not to do's', but I don't see anything to indicate this poster is a troll at this point. He unfortunately has made multiple mistakes in purchasing this dog and is going to have to work very hard to make her a healthy, happy and well-adjusted pet but it can be done if he's willing to put in the work.

In some ways the best thing for the puppy would indeed be to rehome it with someone more knowledgable, particularly as she will need so much attention and help with socialisation. But I haven't wanted to suggest that because these people (and I'm going to assume they are real) seem to love their puppy, they didn't realise it was too young, and that she shouldn't be left so long, and every time we make suggestions they are doing their best to follow them and give this little girl a good life. I agree they need someone to come in and see to the puppy, I wouldn't even leave a full adult alone for 9 hours every day - once in a blue moon when it's unavoidable is one thing, but not every day. Really they could do with someone to come in every 3 hours to take her out to wee, play with her, and socialise her a bit. But they do seem to be trying their hardest with the puppy, and I know how quickly these puppies can get into your hearts, I would hope they aren't going to decide it's too difficult and pass her off to someone else so quickly.

"First time Cocker Spaniel owner, WANT TO START OFF RIGHT." That's the only reason I joined this forum twenty minutes after I brought Daisy home. Daisy has an appmnt. so she can be vaccinated tomorrow. The person that never made a mistake never tried anything new. We're new at this, hence all the stupid mistakes, but Daisy's been worth the trouble. That's all I'm gonna say.

Please don't take too much offense. You've received some really good advice and you seem to be following it perfectly. I've been a member of this forum for YEARS and we have had some really believable posts that turned out to be untrue and vice versa. I hope you'll stick around. We are all helpful and only want the best for you all and Daisy. You've just started out in a little harder situation than many people with such a young pup. My advice on a public forum is to take what you need and ignore the rest. I think you'll find that you get great advice and a lot of support here.

I want to echo the "please don't take offense." As others have stated, this list has seen this type of thread before; though I don't remember any of the "phoney" threads going on this long.

The behavior that you are now describing is normal. The puppy is getting real teeth, she is going to be like a human infant. Biting but not doing it for aggressive purposes.

How to convince people this is not a prank -- keep posting photos of Daisy growing up. You are going to be in for some more surprises. (Just wait until you get to the "7 Month Stupid Stage!")

And if you are pulling a prank -- so be it. This thread is collecting much good information for the "new owner of a very young puppy." The Zim site is read world-wide and many countries do not regulate the age that puppies are sold. If you don't need this information, I'm sure someone else will need it.

Now go and give Daisy a hug!

Colleen Keough