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 Post subject: Potty Training and Crate Accidents
PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2014 5:06 am 
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Hi all....we have a 11 week old Cocker named Hershey....I am at my witts end, we are crate training and at night he does awesome since second night we have had him and in this crate we have not made it smaller it is normal cocker size, holding it about 4 - 5 hours for sleep and no crying at all.....our problem lies during the day while we work, We have set the crate up as we have with dogs before only enough room to stand turn and lay back down, he continues to poop and pee in this crate.....we only leave him approx 4 hours at that time we have a pet sitter that comes and gives him plenty of potty time, and play for a good hr. We have limited water and food in the morning taking it all away at least a hr before we leave...he also continues to just go to the bathroom lie a new born when we are home in the evening in the kitchen as I watch him, and yes I take him our a lot, if he does not go, I take him back out within 15 minutes, it is like he holds it till we come back in....yet there are times when we go out to do his business and it is no issue, he does it and back in we go....I have never had such issues with a pup and the crate, he does not cry as much now when we leave for work, so that part I know he is getting use to, but I am starting to wonder what damage was done by the breeder who used a large crate where their busi could fall right thru the bottom, I think he thinks he is still in that type....I have also started him on Blue Buffelo food and have noticed he has a lot of lose diareha, I thought that was one of the best foods out there, mu other Cocker Shelby 1 1/2 has done great on it.....has anyone had these issues, I am about to lose my mind.....we have our vet apt this evening for 3rd shots and will again seek more advice, our vvet and trainer prob think I am nuts with how many times I contact them and yet with everything I tell them and what I am doing they say I am doing everything right and the way I am suppose to....yet non of it is working :(


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 Post subject: Re: Potty Training and Crate Accidents
PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2014 7:06 am 
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Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2010 3:49 am
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Location: near Daytona Beach, Florida
Here's what I did. I set up an ex-pen, and put everything Gromit would need for the day in there. There was a bed for her to sleep in, a section for her water bowl and chew toys, and at first the entire bottom was covered in pee-pee pads (I literally taped them to the floor). Then, I slowly reduced the area covered in pee pads, so she had separate sleep, eat, and pee areas within the ex-pen. Within a few weeks, she wasn't even using the pee pads at all, she would hold it until I came home for lunch. But I kept one down, just in case.

My personal feeling is that confining an active pup to a crate all day isn't fair to the puppy. That's a very long time to be confined, even with a break during the day. Using an ex-pen gives them a little more freedom to move around, while still keeping them (and your house) safe.

Before everyone who is in favor of crate training chimes in, I'm not saying I'm against crate training - just the opposite. But obviously what you're doing now isn't working, and I can hear the frustration in your email. I'm just suggesting an alternative; one that worked very well for me.

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Darra, devoted hu-mom to
Gromit (blk & tan, 5/7/09)
RonDaView's Cheese, Gromit! OAP, OJP, NAP, NJP, CGC


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 Post subject: Re: Potty Training and Crate Accidents
PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2014 7:22 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2010 8:56 pm
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Location: Brentwood, CA and Vida, OR
Hi,
Congrats on your new baby cocker!

Darra gave you some great ideas! I did much the same thing with Echo when she was a baby.

I think at 11 weeks old, 4 hours is too long to be crated during the day between potty breaks. He is only a baby! Poor little guy just can't hold his pee or poop that long. And if he has diarrhea that just makes it worse for him.

You can to use his age in months to determine how long he should be able to go between potty breaks. So for Hershey, 2-3 hours is max time for him, if he is healthy with NO diarrhea. Having an upset tummy throws the guide rules out the window! Poor guy just can't help it!

Blue Buffalo food may be too rich for this puppy. Did you transition him to this food over a week, mixing it into his original food, giving him a little bit more of the BB each day? Making the switch slowly allows his tummy to get used to the food, and avoid tummy problems. You might have to start all over, back to the original food til tummy settles, and than transition slowly to the BB.

Potty times when you are home need to be regular, and just for potty. Tell him to go potty, and praise him like crazy when he does potty! If no potty, than do as you have been; inside for 10-15 minutes, then outside again. Again, Hershey is a baby, and is still learning!

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Marianne E
Louie 02/15/2002
Cooper 12/07/07
Leila 03/21/08
Bridgette 01/12/09
Echo 08/10/12

Waiting at the Bridge: Little Sister, Savana, Tivy, Slider, Arrow and all the others, I will always love you.


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 Post subject: Re: Potty Training and Crate Accidents
PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2014 10:05 am 
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Yes we transitioned his food when we first got him, they had given him Puppy Chow (YUK) so I am going to hae the vet suggest another food when we see her tonight....Wuld you suggest anything? As far as using what I call the play pen method as suggested, do you put the crate inside of that? And at what point did you go to just a crate.....It is kinda like I think he knows when he is doing wrong, but doesn to know how to tell us yet.....I am sure any frustration you hear in my emails is do to jut myself not understanding, as I have been very lucky in the past with pups and training...I sure do appreciate you all taking the time to get me thru this, it is nice to have someone to really talk to.....All my friends have adult dogs or adult rescue dogs, not may have dealt with pups...


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 Post subject: Re: Potty Training and Crate Accidents
PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2014 10:36 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2010 8:56 pm
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Location: Brentwood, CA and Vida, OR
When my Echo was a pup, I put the crate inside inside the puppy pen area.
That way she had her sleeping space in the crate, and the pee pads area for potty.
Do you have an area with vinyl or linoleum flooring for the puppy pen?
We bought a 6' x 9' vinyl remnant, put that on our laminate floor, and restricted Echo to a 5' x 7' area. She had plenty of room to play and then nap in her crate.
Darra mentioned she taped the pee pads in place, that is a great idea! That will keep them in place.

The Blue Buffalo food may just be too rich for a young pup. Maybe you could mix the BB with the puppy chow for a few months, and try the BB again when Hershey is older.

I fed NutriSource Heartland Grain Free when Echo was small.
Now I feed grain free Salmon & Sweet Potato to all of my cocker spaniels.

_________________
Marianne E
Louie 02/15/2002
Cooper 12/07/07
Leila 03/21/08
Bridgette 01/12/09
Echo 08/10/12

Waiting at the Bridge: Little Sister, Savana, Tivy, Slider, Arrow and all the others, I will always love you.


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 Post subject: Re: Potty Training and Crate Accidents
PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2014 11:57 am 
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Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2010 3:49 am
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Location: near Daytona Beach, Florida
I did not put a crate inside the ex-pen, only a bed. My reasoning is that Cockers can be very smart, and I was afraid she'd figure out how to jump on top of the crate and then jump over the walls of the ex-pen. I guess if you put the crate in the center of the ex-pen that wouldn't be a problem, though.

_________________
Darra, devoted hu-mom to
Gromit (blk & tan, 5/7/09)
RonDaView's Cheese, Gromit! OAP, OJP, NAP, NJP, CGC


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