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 Post subject: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2016 12:50 pm 
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Hi everyone. :hi

I sure hope this forum doesn't shut down. I rescued Ruger nearly a year ago, thankfully stumbled upon this forum, and have received some great advice on taking care of my little angel. A little background. When we rescued Ruger about a year ago, we took him to the vet. He was treated for a really bad ear infection, and then he got the usual vaccinations - a 1 yr rabies shot, and then bortadella and DA2PPL. Since we're not sure how old he is, it is estimated he was about 1 1/2 or 2 last Nov., which would now make him 2 1/2 or 3, but we will never know.

So over the past year, I have done more research as I try to take good care of him, I watched the videos on titers and more. Growing up in a family where my mom preferred alternative medicine to prescription this and prescription that, I am one who prefers to go the natural route and don't want to over medicate or over vaccinate.

I hate unnecessary meds, but Ruger does get Heartguard and Nexguard. We live in Florida on an acre with trees and brush and some grass that isn't treated, so I'm afraid not to give him those meds.

He will be due for a vet visit soon, where I think he will get the 3 yr rabies shot. But what about the other vaccines? Before I ask my vet about titers, I want to be armed with info and not sound like a bumbling idiot. I have a feeling my vet doesn't do titers. When I have brought up other alternative issues (such as when I thought he was allergic to something and mentioned Nutriscan), I feel like the vet dismissed me and secretly rolled her eyes at me. So I am open to finding another vet, but it doesn't seem like there are many alternative options in my area.

Should I continue to search for a vet that does titers? Should I go to my current vet and refuse the other vaccines? And if I hold off on the other vaccines for whatever reason, and then I have to (God forbid) board Ruger, would I have to get the Bortadella vaccine anyway Would I have to get the DA2PPL too? I really don't want to board him, the thought of it makes me sick, but if I have to travel, I don't really have other options. :(

I hope all my questions made sense. Any advice is appreciated.


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2016 2:25 pm 
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Vaccines are totally a hot button issue. My personal opinion is that they are a necessary evil BUT that we over vaccinate our pets. Since you do not know his history - whether had any previous vaccines, I would do a 2nd round as a booster. If not this year, then next. Sometimes, the puppy vaccines dont take so I like to do 2 rounds of adult vaccines.

I would NOT do it with the rabies vaccine. Do that one separately. You can just find a petco/petsmart etc clinic to do the boosters so you dont have to pay a 2nd vet bill if you like and then forward the paperwork to your regular vet so they have it on file.

I would only do kennel cough as needed - boarding, lots of trips to a dog park or competition venues.

I am always absolutely certain to give the rabies boosters (3yr only) on time unless there is a health reason not to. Not only is it super important from a health perspective, but from a legal liability its just not worth messing with IMO. I had a dog who went into anaphalactic shock after a rabies vaccine and it was the last one he ever got but the stress of knowing he was not up to date was awful.

Good luck in your decision


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2016 7:38 pm 
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Thanks so much for responding! I really appreciate your input but have a few more questions/need clarification.

Cockers4ever wrote:
Vaccines are totally a hot button issue. My personal opinion is that they are a necessary evil BUT that we over vaccinate our pets. Since you do not know his history - whether had any previous vaccines, I would do a 2nd round as a booster. If not this year, then next. Sometimes, the puppy vaccines dont take so I like to do 2 rounds of adult vaccines.

Ok. So, I'm assuming that regarding puppy vaccines, I don't know if he ever got any. So would the shots I took him to get last year be considered the first round of adult vaccines? Or are those the puppy vaccines? What would you do a second round of? Just the DA2PPL?

I would NOT do it with the rabies vaccine. Do that one separately. You can just find a petco/petsmart etc clinic to do the boosters so you dont have to pay a 2nd vet bill if you like and then forward the paperwork to your regular vet so they have it on file.

This I don't understand. What would you not do with the rabies vaccine? Not get it with the other shots or not skip a year? Is there a danger of getting it with the other shots?

I would only do kennel cough as needed - boarding, lots of trips to a dog park or competition venues.

I am always absolutely certain to give the rabies boosters (3yr only) on time unless there is a health reason not to. Not only is it super important from a health perspective, but from a legal liability its just not worth messing with IMO. I had a dog who went into anaphalactic shock after a rabies vaccine and it was the last one he ever got but the stress of knowing he was not up to date was awful.

Good luck in your decision


Since he got a 1 year rabies vaccine last year, does that mean he should get the 3 yr one this year? Why wouldn't she give him he 3 yr one last year?
Pardon my ignorance. This is just so new to me and when I took him for shots last year it was overwhelming and I just figured the vet knew best so went with it.

I agree they are a necessary evil, but after listening to the titers videos it seems that they are overdone and perhaps stay in their system just like the shots we got when we were younger.

I'm scared about the anaphylactic shock. That's horrible that happened to your baby.

ETA: pardon the hard to read green text. I'm on my iPhone and was having a hard time selecting the text and choosing a color.


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2016 9:32 pm 
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morewineplease wrote:
Thanks so much for responding! I really appreciate your input but have a few more questions/need clarification.

Cockers4ever wrote:
Vaccines are totally a hot button issue. My personal opinion is that they are a necessary evil BUT that we over vaccinate our pets. Since you do not know his history - whether had any previous vaccines, I would do a 2nd round as a booster. If not this year, then next. Sometimes, the puppy vaccines dont take so I like to do 2 rounds of adult vaccines.

Ok. So, I'm assuming that regarding puppy vaccines, I don't know if he ever got any. So would the shots I took him to get last year be considered the first round of adult vaccines? Or are those the puppy vaccines? What would you do a second round of? Just the DA2PPL?

Ask your vet what they were - adult or puppy? I would assume adult, but they should tell you. It is a good idea to space out vaccines and not mix lymes or lepto or other boosters with rabies to reduce the risk of a reaction. I give Cici the 3 yr rabies. You can give Ruger the 3 yr rabies shot. Ask the vet why she did not give him the 3 yr shot. it could be just more lucrative for them. For lymes and lepto, while my vet had no comment, I did the titers through hemopet and her numbers were good, so no vaccine. You should also look at the incidence of these diseases in your area. I am less concerned about lepto with Cici because she does not ever step in standing water. I titered just to be safe. Vet drew the blood samples for me.

I would NOT do it with the rabies vaccine. Do that one separately. You can just find a petco/petsmart etc clinic to do the boosters so you dont have to pay a 2nd vet bill if you like and then forward the paperwork to your regular vet so they have it on file.

This I don't understand. What would you not do with the rabies vaccine? Not get it with the other shots or not skip a year? Is there a danger of getting it with the other shots?

I would only do kennel cough as needed - boarding, lots of trips to a dog park or competition venues. I agree with this. I don't give Cici this vaccines unless I know she is to be boarded or in the company of other dogs outside the home.It is an optional vaccine.

I am always absolutely certain to give the rabies boosters (3yr only) on time unless there is a health reason not to. Not only is it super important from a health perspective, but from a legal liability its just not worth messing with IMO. I had a dog who went into anaphalactic shock after a rabies vaccine and it was the last one he ever got but the stress of knowing he was not up to date was awful.

Good luck in your decision


Since he got a 1 year rabies vaccine last year, does that mean he should get the 3 yr one this year? Why wouldn't she give him he 3 yr one last year?
Pardon my ignorance. This is just so new to me and when I took him for shots last year it was overwhelming and I just figured the vet knew best so went with it.

I agree they are a necessary evil, but after listening to the titers videos it seems that they are overdone and perhaps stay in their system just like the shots we got when we were younger.

I'm scared about the anaphylactic shock. That's horrible that happened to your baby.

ETA: pardon the hard to read green text. I'm on my iPhone and was having a hard time selecting the text and choosing a color.

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Cici - 8 years old (Gotcha Dec 14, 2013)
Raleigh, North Carolina


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2016 9:59 pm 
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Cici wrote:
morewineplease wrote:
Thanks so much for responding! I really appreciate your input but have a few more questions/need clarification.

Cockers4ever wrote:
Vaccines are totally a hot button issue. My personal opinion is that they are a necessary evil BUT that we over vaccinate our pets. Since you do not know his history - whether had any previous vaccines, I would do a 2nd round as a booster. If not this year, then next. Sometimes, the puppy vaccines dont take so I like to do 2 rounds of adult vaccines.

Ok. So, I'm assuming that regarding puppy vaccines, I don't know if he ever got any. So would the shots I took him to get last year be considered the first round of adult vaccines? Or are those the puppy vaccines? What would you do a second round of? Just the DA2PPL?

Ask your vet what they were - adult or puppy? I would assume adult, but they should tell you. It is a good idea to space out vaccines and not mix lymes or lepto or other boosters with rabies to reduce the risk of a reaction. I give Cici the 3 yr rabies. You can give Ruger the 3 yr rabies shot. Ask the vet why she did not give him the 3 yr shot. it could be just more lucrative for them. For lymes and lepto, while my vet had no comment, I did the titers through hemopet and her numbers were good, so no vaccine. You should also look at the incidence of these diseases in your area. I am less concerned about lepto with Cici because she does not ever step in standing water. I titered just to be safe. Vet drew the blood samples for me.

I would NOT do it with the rabies vaccine. Do that one separately. You can just find a petco/petsmart etc clinic to do the boosters so you dont have to pay a 2nd vet bill if you like and then forward the paperwork to your regular vet so they have it on file.

This I don't understand. What would you not do with the rabies vaccine? Not get it with the other shots or not skip a year? Is there a danger of getting it with the other shots?

I would only do kennel cough as needed - boarding, lots of trips to a dog park or competition venues. I agree with this. I don't give Cici this vaccines unless I know she is to be boarded or in the company of other dogs outside the home.It is an optional vaccine.

I am always absolutely certain to give the rabies boosters (3yr only) on time unless there is a health reason not to. Not only is it super important from a health perspective, but from a legal liability its just not worth messing with IMO. I had a dog who went into anaphalactic shock after a rabies vaccine and it was the last one he ever got but the stress of knowing he was not up to date was awful.

Good luck in your decision


Since he got a 1 year rabies vaccine last year, does that mean he should get the 3 yr one this year? Why wouldn't she give him he 3 yr one last year?
Pardon my ignorance. This is just so new to me and when I took him for shots last year it was overwhelming and I just figured the vet knew best so went with it.

I agree they are a necessary evil, but after listening to the titers videos it seems that they are overdone and perhaps stay in their system just like the shots we got when we were younger.

I'm scared about the anaphylactic shock. That's horrible that happened to your baby.

ETA: pardon the hard to read green text. I'm on my iPhone and was having a hard time selecting the text and choosing a color.


Thank you so much Cici. I made the mistake of reading/replying to Cockers4ever's response right before I went to bed, because then I had to start reading some of the stickied threads. The one on AIHA really got me thinking/worried, then I was clicking on other links in that thread. I tried to go to sleep but couldn't because my mind was racing so I decided to check back here.

Here it is almost 1am and I have to get up in 4 hrs to go to work and I'm recovering from a bad cold and needed my rest. But I'm so darn worried about Ruger's vaccinations that should be coming up. It's been in the back of my mind but so much other stuff has been happening, now the time has come for me to decide what to do and I'm not prepared. I'm going to do the titers. That's what my gut is telling me to do, especially after reading some of the scary things I have tonight. I have a few other vets I can call, and if they don't do titers, I'll do what you did.

Thanks so much for your input. You have always been so kind and helpful to me. I really don't want these forums to go away. I don't do Facebook (yet) but clicked on the Zim facebook group and it's just not the same. Lots of cute pics of people's cockers, but not the wealth of info here. I'm set in my ways. I like old fashioned forums.

Anyway, I have to try to get to sleep. Good night!


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 6:38 am 
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First of all, I wanted to tell you what a cute baby you have!!

I feel as though vaccinations are a necessary evil, just don't overdo it. Rabies does need 2 vaccinations to build immunity. The second vaccination needs to be done within a year of the first. That is why the vet only gave you a 1 year certificate, and now will give a 3 year. The dose and everything is the same. If you don't give the second vaccination within a year, you will get another 1 year certificate, so don't let that lapse or you'll have to vaccinate more often.

Bortadella is not titered. It's effectiveness is questionable, as there are lots of strains and other causes such as molds, plus it offers a very short protection window. I do think it takes a couple of weeks to offer immunity, so if you were to board your dog, you would need to plan accordingly.

I would definitely titer for distemper/parvo. One adult vaccination (one puppy, if the mother's immunity is no longer present) is effective (should be for life). The levels should not matter, they fluctuate as to whether or not the dog has been exposed to the diseases recently. Some people titer yearly, every 3 years, or just once, whatever you are comfortable with. I'm not sure what vaccine you were given, but be aware that not everything is titered. I believe the vaccination you dog received also contained protection for Lepto. I don't think Lepto is titered, does not offer lifetime/longtime immunity. If Lepto is not an issue where you live, it should not be given.

Of course, as has already been mentioned, do not have the rabies given at the same time as other vaccinations.

I went to a talk given by Charles Schultz (not the Peanuts creator!!). He is on the world animal vaccination committee. I learned so much at the talk. Google him and add to your knowledge!! Good luck!! Teri


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 6:59 am 
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Also since vets typically just want to vaccinate yearly with no questions asked, they usually do not offer titers. You can watch videos by Dr. Karen Becker online to be more informed on the subject. My vet is nice enough to respect and not judge my questioning mind. She may or may not agree, but she does not object to providing me with blood samples when I want to titer, and does not argue when I skip the vaccines. They always send me reminders for the due dates of the vaccines, but I just call them and say I am waiving them. Do not ever be afraid to voice your opinion or ask questions - no matter the vet.

I agree with giving the Parvo one - it's a serious illness. Also, you can directly ask Dr. Dodds on hemopet's website. She answered a lot of my questions.

I think there's a middle ground to be achieved. We need some vaccines, but they certainly overdone. For example, I once had a vet who kept pushing the bordatella shot even though we never board Cici or take her to dog parks (just not her thing) and we didn't have a trip planned either.

Do you take Ruger for walks in the woods or is he exposed to ticks a lot? Re: Lymes you can complement your flea and tick regimen with this natural shampoo http://www.groomerschoice.com/Bark-2-Ba ... nfo/BBCPG/

You can mix a bottle and give it to the groomer when you drop him off.

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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 7:47 am 
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Thank you Teri and Cici's Mom (sorry I always call you Cici but then realize you are Cici's mom).

I just got off the phone with my vet and they don't do titers. Called another vet that was referred to me and they don't do titers either. Called another vet that I had found on the internet that offers some alternative/complementary medicine and they do do titers. $130 for parvo/distemper. I think that's a little high based on what I've read here, but due to lack of time, I think I am going to give this vet a shot. If I don't like the vet much, at least I will have the titer numbers for Ruger and can proceed from there.

The receptionist asked if I want a rabies titer too, but based on what Teri said, it sounds like I still want to give him the 3 yr shot within a year of the 1st shot. I think I probably have to do that to meet county regulations anyway. Thank you Teri for explaining all that. Makes sense now.

So while I could ask my current vet if they could draw blood then send it in myself, I feel like they'd be rolling their eyes at me. I'll give this new vet a chance and let them do the legwork for me, this time. I'm running out of time.

I've watched several of Karen Becker's videos, so helpful and full of information, and will google the Peanut's creator too, j/k Teri ;)
There is such good current information out there, a shame that you have to go searching for it, and that most vets are ignorant of it. But, I feel that way about the majority of doctors anyway.

I have to get back to work now, but just want to tell you how much I appreciate your input!


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 7:49 am 
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Cici's mom - forgot to say thanks for the shampoo rec. Ruger doesn't go walking in the woods, but we do have some wooded areas near us, across the street. I'm afraid of ticks and feel like it'd be hard to find them on him and I'd be looking for them constantly. I'm a paranoid mama...

I've also been giving him the Nusentia probiotics, I think you recommended those. He is doing really well. He is happy and cuddly and my best buddy. :love


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 1:40 pm 
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Cici's mom - I ended up emailing Dr. Dodds and she responded fairly quickly. Because we didn't know Ruger's background, I was just very unsure about her vaccine protocol. She confirmed that I should get the 3 yr rabies vaccine, and do the titers for parvo/distempter. She was surprised my vet wouldn't do the bloodwork. So I called my vet one more time and a different girl answered. She thought they did do titers and even verified so with the vet. So yay! I don't have to mess with changing vets right now. This Wednesday, Ruger will get the rabies shot and the titers, and hopefully won't need more vaccinations.

The receptionist thought they sent the bloodwork to Idexx, but the office manager is going to call me back tomorrow with more info and pricing. Do you think I should ask if they can send it to hemopet?


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 11:20 pm 
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We were the second dog owner in the vets office history as a 8 year old male cocker to be ever tested for titers. In California it was a high cost to do so. I'm guessing five to six times more than the vaccination. He had no problem with every high reading for antibodies. To me it was well worth the extra cost to know.

I even showed the vet the cheap test parvo/distempter on youtube but would not apply for it. He said he'll show the Human Society which it was for. All he wanted was the money. He retired last year.

At 10.8 year old we just had the rabies shot and was turned into the city to pay up to date dog license of 11 lost tax years. Now he is a licensed to be a dog. One rabies shot for all dogs small to large seems a bit much.

Joe


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2016 7:18 am 
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morewineplease wrote:
Cici's mom - I ended up emailing Dr. Dodds and she responded fairly quickly. Because we didn't know Ruger's background, I was just very unsure about her vaccine protocol. She confirmed that I should get the 3 yr rabies vaccine, and do the titers for parvo/distempter. She was surprised my vet wouldn't do the bloodwork. So I called my vet one more time and a different girl answered. She thought they did do titers and even verified so with the vet. So yay! I don't have to mess with changing vets right now. This Wednesday, Ruger will get the rabies shot and the titers, and hopefully won't need more vaccinations.

The receptionist thought they sent the bloodwork to Idexx, but the office manager is going to call me back tomorrow with more info and pricing. Do you think I should ask if they can send it to hemopet?
Yes, I also asked for pricing first and compared with hemopet. My vet's lab was too expensive, so i went with hemopet. If you follow the instructions on hemopet's website on how to send the serum, it's fine for the vet to draw it. I printed out the instructions for quantity and mailing and gave it to the vet. They offered to mail it, but I was going to the post office anyway, so I express mailed it in bubble wrap. Glad he is doing well. He's got a great mom!

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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2016 9:10 am 
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Hi and welcome!

You've gotten very good information already. I would just reiterate the advice to get the 3 year rabies on time...

It's so hard not knowing your dog's history... all you can do is get him up to date and then make your own informed decision from here out. Rabies is required by law... I do what is required. The only reason to titer rabies would be to make sure your dog shows immunity - for your own information...otherwise I just follow the law. I feel Distemper/parvo is needed for puppies but after the initial series, I've titered my dog ... she is 6 years old and still shows good numbers. (I titered distemper/parvo at a year the first time and since then every 3 years.) I don't bother with any of the others . To me, kennel cough is like the flu shot... hit or miss. There are times when it is needed but no way to know if you will be covered for the current strain of virus. If at all possible space any vaccines out, doing single doses at a time.

Good luck!

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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:59 am 
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Joe, Cici's mom and Lisa...

Thank you for your input!

Talked to the vet's office again yesterday and to send to Idexx it would cost about $112 for just a positive or negative reading, $200+ if I wanted an actual number. They will draw the blood and send to Hemopet for me, so that's what I'm going to do.

I was googling all sorts of stuff yesterday and read where the thimerasol-free vaccines were recommended, I believe by Dr. Becker, Dr. Dodds and others. I called my vet to ask which they use and they use the ones with thimerasol. But she was able to get her hands on the Merial TF 3 yr vaccine for me, thankfully. They are going to look at me like a paranoid freak when I ask to see the vial or whatever before they give him the rabies shot. I didn't go through all this effort and research for him to be given the regular one.

Last time I saw the female vet who seemed to dismiss my concerns about Ruger's itching. She prescribed an antibiotic and an antihistamine. How helpful. This time I chose to see the male vet who is the one that recommended glucosamine for Ruger's knees. He said Ruger was on the border of whether they recommend surgery or not for patellar luxation, but said to try the glucosamine first and it's done wonders, so I hope he is more openminded about titering and understands my concerns about vaccinating.

Anyway, Ruger's appt is this afternoon and I hope all goes well. I feel better after reading the info on this forum, having input from you all, as well as from Dr. Dodds (we exchanged a few emails and I couldn't be more grateful).

Ruger and I thank you all!

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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 3:38 pm 
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Hopefully soon the rabies vaccine protocol will change. I remember with my previous dog, 20 plus years ago, I was about 3 weeks late in getting her in, I knew the vet both in and out of the office, he read me the riot act about being late, but he did give her the shot for 3 years. Fast forward that to a few years ago with Snickie's 3 year, and I was late a couple of weeks and he said no problem. What? Since then, I have found out that the vaccines come into the vet as a four year vaccine, but they have to give you the tag only for 3 years, I don't live in Mass. but I read that their protocol has recently changed and that if you can prove your dog has already had previous shots and you were forgetful or negligent, the shot could be given for three years and not one year.



QUOTE
[ So over the past year, I have done more research as I try to take good care of him, I watched the videos on titers and more. Growing up in a family where my mom preferred alternative medicine to prescription this and prescription that, I am one who prefers to go the natural route and don't want to over medicate or over vaccinate.]



Since you like alternative medicine, I know Joe on here likes to give raw chicken feet to his dog for the natural glucosamine, I can't do that, just seeing them in the grocery store makes me queasy, but you can make bone broth and get the same results. When Snickie was three, the vet said she had a luxating patella, which I had seen her hopping around with her knee locked up. I upped her exercise, and started the crock pot cooking, and she will be 7 next month and she has been fine, her knee hasn't locked up since. And I keep my fingers crossed that she never blows out her ACL, when you see the knee locking up a lot, take warning. In order to get the full benefits it has to be slow cooked for 18- 24 hours. easy to do with a crock pot. Below is a link, one of many out there. Also good for any dog that may have leaky gut or allergies.


Hoping all went well today.




http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/re ... one-broth/


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 10:02 pm 
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So you found out the cost of my titer test in California. About 190. Oliver either goes with us or stays at grandpa's, so we don't have to worry about kennel cough. The vet never gave us a certificate for his titers test. It's what we know that counts.

Joe


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Fri Nov 18, 2016 7:35 am 
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Denise in CT wrote:
Hopefully soon the rabies vaccine protocol will change. I remember with my previous dog, 20 plus years ago, I was about 3 weeks late in getting her in, I knew the vet both in and out of the office, he read me the riot act about being late, but he did give her the shot for 3 years. Fast forward that to a few years ago with Snickie's 3 year, and I was late a couple of weeks and he said no problem. What? Since then, I have found out that the vaccines come into the vet as a four year vaccine, but they have to give you the tag only for 3 years, I don't live in Mass. but I read that their protocol has recently changed and that if you can prove your dog has already had previous shots and you were forgetful or negligent, the shot could be given for three years and not one year.



QUOTE
[ So over the past year, I have done more research as I try to take good care of him, I watched the videos on titers and more. Growing up in a family where my mom preferred alternative medicine to prescription this and prescription that, I am one who prefers to go the natural route and don't want to over medicate or over vaccinate.]



Since you like alternative medicine, I know Joe on here likes to give raw chicken feet to his dog for the natural glucosamine, I can't do that, just seeing them in the grocery store makes me queasy, but you can make bone broth and get the same results. When Snickie was three, the vet said she had a luxating patella, which I had seen her hopping around with her knee locked up. I upped her exercise, and started the crock pot cooking, and she will be 7 next month and she has been fine, her knee hasn't locked up since. And I keep my fingers crossed that she never blows out her ACL, when you see the knee locking up a lot, take warning. In order to get the full benefits it has to be slow cooked for 18- 24 hours. easy to do with a crock pot. Below is a link, one of many out there. Also good for any dog that may have leaky gut or allergies.


Hoping all went well today.




http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/re ... one-broth/



Thank you Denise! Ruger's vet appt. went well. He got the 3 yr TF rabies vaccine. My vet didn't really say much about it nor ask why I requested TF. Looking back, I kind of find it odd that the vet's office never even reminded me Ruger was due for his annual check-up/shots and that I needed to get it done within the year. I was the one that called them. Maybe they are annoyed with me, lol. I have spent enough money there over the past year so they should be willing to deal with me and my many questions (being a new overprotective mommy, I brought him there for things I probably didn't need to).

My vet did ask why I wanted titers and I gave him a very brief summary why. He said something about the stuff on the internet being scary. And I thought to myself, no, not knowing about the risks and then finding out the hard way is scary - there is a lot of valuable info out there that you vets don't share with us, such as the risks of vaccines. Kind of reminds me of how you don't hear about all the horrible things that go on in hospitals, unless you or a loved one has been there and you really see what goes on. I digress.

He did comment about how some of his vet friends get titers so they don't have to get another rabies shot, but that he doesn't want to be bothered with titers so just gets the shot anyway. He said it's better to have more antibodies. Alrighty then.

Anyway, I hope the vaccine protocol changes too. There's no reason it shouldn't except there won't be as much money to be made. And I really do believe people are ignorant and resistant to change. Get with the times people and take advantage of the new research and technology!

Sorry to be so preachy, I am in a mood today.

Thank you so much for the info on chicken bones/broth, knees, and that link! Earlier in the week I came across that dogsnaturallymagazine site and I know I will refer to it in the future. I really appreciate your input!


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Fri Nov 18, 2016 8:33 am 
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The vet sounds like the one that left that we left before him looking for a new vet. Titers testing is only for the Human Society to save money here in California.

There's two ways to feed chicken bone, raw don't feed the drum sticks, any other part is only, chicken wings if you can find them. Our Asian store is closing up and sold to Safeway. As Cici stated a crock-pot chicken, one can cook bones for ten to twelve hours they turn into a powder this is the drum stick safe.

My guess any bone will work cooking that long. Some dogs can't handle chicken as they are feed grain.

Joe


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Fri Nov 18, 2016 10:37 am 
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Joe in North Bay Ca wrote:
The vet sounds like the one that left that we left before him looking for a new vet. Titers testing is only for the Human Society to save money here in California.

There's two ways to feed chicken bone, raw don't feed the drum sticks, any other part is only, chicken wings if you can find them. Our Asian store is closing up and sold to Safeway. As Cici stated a crock-pot chicken, one can cook bones for ten to twelve hours they turn into a powder this is the drum stick safe.

My guess any bone will work cooking that long. Some dogs can't handle chicken as they are feed grain.

Joe


Thanks Joe! Wish titer testing was more common. Wish the vets would present that option rather than just vaccinating. I would like to try to find a holistic vet in my area. Or at least a vet that is more open minded. I did what I had to do this year so I have some time to look before the next visit.

Thanks for the chicken info. I bet the dogs would love it!


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 Post subject: Re: Another question regarding vaccinations
PostPosted: Sat Nov 26, 2016 9:19 pm 
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4szeiIoizkg

crock pot cooking

Tucker the Lab died of liver cancer, don't recall what age.

Joe


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